Interview with an international - Raghavi

I've always been displaced from one place to another since my childhood therefore I'm very familiar with that feeling that you don't belong. 

 ‘My name is Raghavi , I am a psychologist, and I work in the international division in U-centre Behandelcentrum in Epen. U-centre is a mental health organisation that supports many internationals. We see in-house patients so we have a local section and an international section. 

I work in the international department, and I recently started my own private practice. For now, my private practice is run solely online, which is the best way to start because I still need to find an office space. However, these are future plans based on the number of clients I will have. At the moment most of my clients live far from the Maastricht Region, in their case an online session is easier.’

So, your main patient focus is internationals all over the world? 

‘Yes, everywhere in the world and anyone who is looking for a psychologist who speaks in English and who relates to the experience of being an expat. I've always been roaming around. I've always been displaced from one place to another since my childhood therefore I'm very familiar with that feeling that you don't belong. 

I've experienced for myself the rush of moving to a new city. You're here for either love or your career but you'll always have this feeling: “Do I belong here? Do I fit in?” It will take some time to find new friends and if you're lucky you'll find them. If not, then there is the feeling of being unsettled. I think I can help other people overcome this feeling.’

So you're saying this is a common feeling for everyone who is trying to settle in in a new country. It doesn't matter whether this is in the Netherlands, or for example Spain or anywhere else?

‘Exactly, and my private practice gives me a little bit more freedom to see patients online. I can help them wherever they are in the world with mood complaints, anxiety, stress and more. Struggling with questions like: “Am I doing the right thing in my life, am I going in the right direction?” 

I can even help people who are going through a major change without travelling. A major change in role from student to employee or from being single to having a family.’

Do you have a few tips for people that have recently moved to a new place and find that they don't have the sense of belonging like you mentioned before?

‘There is actually a lot that you can do. But one major piece of advice is to keep in touch with your family and friends back home. To have a schedule where you plan time to stay in touch with them. We tend to forget this, but it is very important. I've forgotten about it too. It's easier nowadays with video calls where you can actually see them. I find that those conversations really help. I'm living with my husband here, but I still miss home. My parents live in India. Ringing them and texting them makes the missing part more bearable. 

I also think we fight our thoughts and emotions a lot. We think that we are not supposed to be anxious and we are not supposed to feel out of place. We have this pressure that we put on ourselves that you need to belong. As soon as you reach the next destination you need to have your own group of friends and belong to the community. I think that pressure is a lot. We can do with more realistic acceptance and give ourselves some grace to feel things. Learn to reassure yourself that it is alright to feel out of place and that it is valid to have these feelings.

One other thing you can mention is to learn the language. Although it is not always easy, especially if you move to different countries more often. Learning a new language every so many years can be exhausting, because it can make you feel like a child. You're an adult but your phrases are very simple. My Dutch sentences are like the ones of a first or second grader. So it can be a frustrating experience, but I still think that learning the languages helps to connect with the local community.’

If you move to a place with the idea of finding a job once you have the right level of language experience, it's going to take you a long time and during your language education you won't have a job. It is not something you can compromise on. 

You are basically a newcomer yourself in the Maastricht Region. How is the experience so far?

‘I do enjoy Maastricht for its proximity to the water and its closeness to the borders. Travelling to Germany and Belgium is very easy. I also like the old architecture here and the variety of local artist exhibits in the city centre. I’m a photographer as well and I love walking around the city with my camera.’

Is there a difference in living in Breda or Maastricht in how people respond to internationals?

‘Honestly I don't see that many differences between the two cities. I think in general people in the Netherlands are very welcoming. If people see me struggle sometimes with the Dutch language, for example when I am at a supermarket they are always kind enough to help. One thing that surprised me about the Netherlands is that everyone speaks English. In my few travels to France, I had a totally different experience. 

The Dutch people are so good at it, it takes away the motivation to learn Dutch. Wherever you go people shift the conversation to English. I also work in an international environment and my clients are expats. But still, I think it's good to learn the language. Otherwise, you will always feel like a stranger out of place. When you're out at the weekend or taking a walk around the neighborhood, you will hear a language around you that you don't understand. 

So even if it's a difficult language to learn, like Dutch, I think it helps to try at least. But take it slow.’

Do you go to school to learn the language? 

‘I am currently learning A2 level Dutch as I also need to be familiar with the language at a professional level for my BIG registration. That is a kind of struggle for expats, especially in the healthcare sector. In the Netherlands there are different categories: You have a basic psychologist, GZ psychologist with further specialization in psychotherapy and clinical psychology. then you have a head end psychologist and then you have a psych therapeutic psychologist and on the other end you have a clinical psychologist. Comprehension of the Dutch language at B2+ is mandatory to work at the same level as I used to work before. 

I was already working as a head end psychologist and as a clinical psychologist because of my education and years of experience. But here in the Netherlands I needed to start again because I don't speak Dutch. I need to prove my credentials again and my level of experience. Without learning the language, you just hit a ceiling. The demands are quite high because in my field of work you need to learn a university level of Dutch (B2+). I have a long journey to go before I get there. 

If you move to a place with the idea of finding a job once you have the right level of language experience, it's going to take you a long time and during your language education you won't have a job. It is not something you can compromise on. So, another piece of advice would be: start to work at an achievable level and learn the language when you get there.’

So, what I did was to blindly apply to mental health institutions. Then their HR department would get back to me and tell me what I was missing ... The rejection letters actually helped me find a job.

How did you end up in the Netherlands? Why did you choose this country?

‘I moved for love. My husband was already working in the Netherlands and he had been in Europe for a long time. It was either going to be a long distance relationship or one of us would give up our job. We chose that I would give up my job and travel to Europe. I'm still happy with that decision even if I was a bit scared at the beginning. If you ask for information online or read about experiences of other people in the healthcare sector you can receive very discouraging feedback. However, luckily my experience was very different from theirs.’’

Who helped you at the beginning? Services and or people?

‘Unfortunately, I had to do it on my own. The BIG registry gives you an overview but there was little to find about what you needed to start working. Or at least I couldn't find the information on how to find a job without language constraints. So, what I did was to blindly apply to mental health institutions. Then their HR department would get back to me and tell me what I was missing. 

That was the starting point for me, this way I learned that I needed something called a Logo statement or a credential evaluation from IDW. The rejection letters actually helped me find a job.’

That must have taken you a lot of effort.

‘True, and it was at times pursuing things blindly because I couldn't predict what would happen in the end. To remain hopeful, that was the most difficult part. 

The rest of the process, the formality part like registering and getting a BSN, was pretty smooth. That is very efficient in the Netherlands. I had all the paperwork done in Breda. I didn't face any problems there. My main problem was the working part, my career. I think it rarely happens that people apply for work in the healthcare sector if they haven't studied in the Netherlands.’

Did you encounter any difficulties apart from finding a job?

‘I don’t blame a particular party or person but as an international newcomer you always doubt yourself. For example, I would like to mow the lawn today. At what time is it acceptable to make that much noise? Everywhere you go there are these unspoken rules that you have in a community that a newcomer is not always aware of. You might unintentionally upset someone, and I don't want to come over as disrespectful.

Cultures differ a lot from country to country. In my home country, for example, you are not allowed to say “no”. That is rude. You are always obliged to say “yes”. Here that is not the case. You say: 'I'm busy, I can't come.' It's more direct and I like it. However, there are so many differences and I'm still learning. I think more internationals experience these feelings.’

What is it that you do then, when you feel that way?

‘I check in with my neighbours or text them, after hesitating a lot. 

I live in Heer, which is a very close community and the people are very friendly.’

What are your future plans? Do you want to stay in the Netherlands?

‘I don't know yet. There are certain aspects of living in the Netherlands that I really like. But I also feel a calling for back home. My parents are getting older. I always feel that at some point I need to go back for my family.

On the other hand I would like to experience how it feels to work as an entrepreneur. I have been working as a psychologist for 12 years now and in those years I have always been employed by a hospital or institution. I want to explore how it goes with my own company.’

Could you explain a bit more about your private practice?

‘Yes, people can find me at: Heedmentalhealth.com and if they are interested in an appointment, they can leave their contact details. The first session I try to focus on the basics. Where do they come from? What is their job? What is their goal? Can I help them? The main focus is to see if you and I align. If we feel there is a good match, we make an agreement to see each other again and in what frequency. I believe in having a more structured approach than just talking. We set goals and work towards them. All my sessions are 60 minutes.’

How have you experienced the process of starting your own company in the Netherlands?

‘In this case I think it was pretty straightforward. You have to register with the Kamer van Koophandel, KVK (Chamber of Commerce). Then you need to arrange all the insurances that you have to take out. If you are a mental health professional, you need a complaint registry in case somebody has a problem with the service you provide. I am a recognized NIP psychologist and therefore backed by a governmental party. But in this case, I could easily find most of the information I needed online.

Being an expat, I thought it would be very difficult to start on my own, but I didn't find any difficulties there. I feel like the Dutch government really encourages people to start their own business. Which feels very empowering!’

Heedmentalhealth.com